Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 17:40Its amazing, the longer I play this game, the more things stay the same. Every once in awhile, you will run across someone who looks to everyone else for his or her own problems, and would rather tear down their park, their contacts, their entire way of doing things, when things are not going their way. This game is rife with perfect examples, of this. And thankfully, just like clockwork, another underachiever has stepped to the fore to emblazon his name on to the list of whiners that have played this game.
Brilliant. Here is the appearance from all the way out east of you. You wanted the top spot, and realized you needed to fight for it. And low and behold every time it was pointed out those dirty things were being said about Tal or Kord, offering things to folks, when anyone dug to see where rumors started there you sat, under the pile of shit, claiming it was all a misunderstanding. Yes, must always be the boys fault, or this person or that… Never yours nope…. Of course not…. Then for one reason or another your partner dropped running (no thought perhaps you may have some little thing to do with it Ja Ne?) and you sit, Fuming because what you DESERVED was denied you. I mean you did eventually declare… right… who could dare but bask in your brilliance... why they must be using dirt themselves.
And, months later, your partner is knighted for his work, and you are not. He passed a circle vote, and held the confidence of the monarch, who used his mandated right to knight him, and not you.
So it only took you what 3 days to come up with a suitably whiney post to try and tear down anothers honor. I would have thought it would have taken you at LEAST a week to build up this level of Angst, but what the hell do I know anyway. I am just a Radish…
So, what’s next? Going to burn your IM Symbol in the fire in protest?
Then again, don’t worry you are in good company. Some of the “Best” characters in our game have decided that destroying others is the way to get ahead. And there is always the “you all are beta, you don’t share the dream, and you are the ANTICHRIST TAL! YOU CANNOT HAVE MY MOTHER!” approach that your leaning too… All I need to do is get you a few boxes of wine and you’ll have the shtick complete…. Of course, you would still not be doing a 10th of what he did… but you can save that for after you drive everyone who does not worship at the circle of your friends out.
(See there you go, my sinus infection has claimed me, I almost gave JW a compliment. I must be ill…)
And Before you start. I AM the anti-Christ. I play serious dirty politics, and everyone knows it. I have caused far more damage to this game then you probably ever could, by chance or desire. I am evil. I am a liar. I am the cause for Moss’s grey Hair. I am the reason Russ is a pervert, and I hid Wolframs shampoo, causing him not to come out as often. Anything I missed? Good I admit to it all. Everything you want to claim about how evil I am I enthusiastically agree too.. What ever it is… Hell, I taught Vlad Tepes to spike his first Turk.
And it will not change a bit of what I said either. Your still whining, about an award you wanted for your self, and tearing down others because you did not get your way. a
Yah know, I have not said much about Grendel in this have I? See I for one know he is strong enough to take it. He is a Knight, and was a Knight long before Kord belted him. This will not destroy him. I have faith in him. You have lived up to my faith in you as well.
Though personally I would rather you proved me wrong.
“Part time Satanists, who needs em…”
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Rewth
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Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 18:06SirZodiac wrote: And Before you start. I AM the anti-Christ. I play serious dirty politics, and everyone knows it. I have caused far more damage to this game then you probably ever could, by chance or desire. I am evil. I am a liar. I am the cause for Moss’s grey Hair. I am the reason Russ is a pervert, and I hid Wolframs shampoo, causing him not to come out as often. Anything I missed? Good I admit to it all. Everything you want to claim about how evil I am I enthusiastically agree too.. What ever it is… Hell, I taught Vlad Tepes to spike his first Turk.
wow Zodiac.... i'm impressed. though i think you left out one thing:
"i am completely clueless as to the motivations of those involved and like to stir the pot with spite and conjecture."
thank you for contributing. you have restored my faith in the internet.
pardon me, but my son just spit up from all the second hand sarcasm that just filled my room. i have to find a wet wipe."But right now I'm a little concerned about my pants, since I don't know where they are." - Valathina Nailo
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Talisin
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Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 22:11Obie keeps referring to emails regarding the election mess, which really confuses us. Frankly, none of us feel we have anything to hide or that any of us did anything wrong. So after conferring with Kord and Grendel and gaining their permission, I have posted all of the emails I can find that passed between Kord, Grendel, Obie and I regarding the incident, as well as a few private emails that went between Grendel and I.
Those of you who would rather get on with your lives and have fun, please do so. Those of you who would like to judge for yourselves can go here http://www.imduchy.org/emails.htm and see what Obie is referring to.
There may be a post I missed, but I think this is almost everything. I obviously don't have access to anyone else's private emails, so I can't testify as to what might have happened that I don't know about. But this should be all that is relevant, since it's *my* "shitty, dirty politics" that Obie seems to think these emails will prove. So again- ignore this, or read and judge for yourself. We think this is a better course of action than allowing the vague references and insinuations to continue.Tal
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Edan
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Posts: 358
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 23:40whoa...that was a long read....
I'm curious about a couple things?
1. Obie, have you ever been to a cok meeting?
How do you know its the " good ol' boys club " ?
I know a lot of knights that totally despise eachother...I've talked to a lot of knights about people they think deserve to be knighted and discussed their opinions on the different people, and I gotta tell you...i recieved different answers from every single one of them.
I've talked to people that totally despise some of the other knights, but think that they have given a lot to this game, and have a lot more to offer it, and THAT is why they opted to give their aproval for that person to be knighted..and they didnt let their personal feelings get in the way.
a knight should be kind of like a reeve right? unbiased?
they shouldnt be a fucking prick just because they can be. they shouldnt let their personal feelings get in the way of important decisions.
I can guarantee that not every knight in COK loves grendel...but they all saw ( 0r most of them ) that he had a lot to offer amtgard still, and that he'd already dedicated himself whole heartidly.
Sorry for my spelling and grammer btw..i worked all day and im hella tired.
2. Obie...if you think the " CoK is broken " why in the fuck are you bitching about it?
why are you causeing drama?
why are you bringing this all public, if you think its broken, and you dont respect it, and your not going to let it effect you?
what is the point of starting all this shit, burning all these bridges, and causeing trouble with everyone?
it just seems like your acting like you care...but you swear you dont?
I'm not taking sides here, just stateing my opinion and trying to clear up a couple things.
Anyone that knows you Obie, knows that you have a lot to offer amtgard. Everyone that knows you knows that your always willing to help, and that your always there if we need advice or have questions, your a very intelligent and loving person, and id really hate for this whole thing to make you hate me or something...
stay in contact homie...and remember, its just a game....
Would you get hella pissed at me and sever all ties and call me a lieing trader and talk massive amounts of shit to/about me if i cheated while playing magic with you?
no
so why with amtgard....its not life...its a game.
I had to tell myself that awhile ago...after i was done being duke...i was just so tired of everyone's bs, everyone sucking up...it was fucking lame.
but then my " amtgard rolemodel " reminded me of something. he reminded me of something really important.
Amtgard is just a game.
How seriously can you take this game?
we run around in dresses hitting eachother with padded sticks.
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 23:52Rioko wrote: ok... a lot a reading... -sigh- Grendel, I have to say... damn. I heard that you were knighted and I didn't know what to think. Whenever you and I were in the same area, you seemed very distant and somewhat cold. I take part blame for this thought. I never came to you and had a real conversation. I apologize if there are anyhard feelings. The question about knighthood was already there and what I wrote was not about you alone. ~Rioko
no hard feelings at all, when you first started posting on the CD forum I thought, "wow, Rioko's fairly new to Amtgard and she's already looking at holding office and wants to help out all the time, that's pretty cool" I think the first time I met you was at CD when we had the clash game, I remember feeling a bit awkward being the veteran fighter of our team, I didn't want to order you or the other team members around, I didn't really know you folks and kept forgetting your names, so I remember trying to help guide our team with things that didn't use names like "defense to the right!" I remember running into you again here and there and saying what's up, or seeing that you were busy and I didn't want to interupt you. I didn't ever mean to come off as cold.. it's funny how easy it is to build up in your head what you think is going on without ever speaking to the person about it.. I apologize if I came off as cold or distant, who knows it might have been an odd day for me.Dragoon Strike First. Strike Hard. No Mercy. Hús Vetra Skald IMU
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QuietEyed1
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Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 23:52[doublepost]
Post edited by: QuietEyed1, at: 2005/10/04 23:55
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QuietEyed1
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Posts: 569
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/04 23:55At least I got a kick-ass belt out of the deal.
It's almost surreal how different people can get on the internet, I've noticed. Typing scathing and hurtful things is easy. Being offended and lashing out is a matter of putting words on a glowing monitor, directed at little icons with aliases under them. Nobody's real, and nothing is permanent.
I'm saddened that one of the Northern Holdfast's better players brought this about, and I apologize to all of Crimson Dawn for any negative ideas they may get from this thread about the core kingdoms. I don't blame Obie for any opinions he may have, as without knowing the people involved, one can easily assume the worst about anyone. I myself didn't know what to believe at an earlier point, when the whole incident concerning Edan and myself being 'bought' came up. That was a byproduct of something done in another kingdom, namely a player buying 'dues paid' status for dozens of players, if they promised to vote one way. Quite the scandel, at the time.
I as well had it occur to me that the belt offered to me might be a political move. I was essentially unnoticed at that point, and not nearly as nefarious as I am today. So a belt was more than a strip of leather (and kickass chainmail weave), and it still is. I felt undeserving of the honor, and thus uncertain as to the motives behind it, all as a result of the scandel in another kingdom I'd never even been to.
For that reason, I can understand Obie's reasoning. He thought as I did at that point. The difference being, Obie expressed his concerns, vividly, with no desire but to protect the honor of the kingdom, I am certain. So I can't blame him for this.
As for the Grendel's belt... I honestly don't know everything that happened between Obie, Grendel, Tal and Kord during the weeks leading up to the election. What I can say with conviction is all four of them do their best whenever possible, to make the game more than it is, however they are able. They're all good people, and it's a pleasure to know all of them, even if Tal scares the life out of me. I trust that however this issue came about, the people involved have reasons they believe in to pursue their standpoints, and those reasons are valid. Protecting the prestige of the knight's belt, or defending one's close friends, or upholding the ideals of the game, all of these issues seem to be present. Again, all I can say is I believe I know them all well enough to say nobody is out for their own personal gain, by any means.
As the consort of the Northern Holdfast, I apologize that this has turned into what it has, in hardly a day. While I'm just an elected official who ran against nobody, I do feel responsible when one my homepark's players, people who I've played with joyously the last year, begin to hurt one another. It's not something I enjoy.
Kord - You offered me a belt because you thought I deserved one. This I am certain of, and remain certain of.
Tal - You're evil, and evil, and more evil. But you're not 'politics' brand evil by any means.
Obie - If you come to the park, you'll still receive a smile and a handshake, man. I respect your achievements and what you've done for the park long before I damn you for anything else.
Grendel - Wear your belt proudly, because it's been visible on you well before any white strip of leather adorned you.
To everyone else, let's keep our claws sheathed. This kind of thing can break a park, quite soundly, with no hope of recovery. I don't intend to let that happen, by any means I have available to me.
Sorry for another novella, Rewth.Quiet
Baron of the Northern Holdfast, August '08 -
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Brennen MacGregor
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Posts: 142
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 00:01Wow.
That make you all feel better?
So how was this all MY fault again?
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Uncle Willie
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Posts: 40
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 00:30GODSDAMIT! All of you have stired the shit to the point there is none left for me!
Obie and Kord are gay and are secretly lovers! Brenan likes to watch!I drink beer.
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Cullum
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Posts: 246
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 01:20Orlando Ebasdotter wrote: Maybe I expected too much out of ol' Chuck. Who knows? I can't fault him for taking care of his health, but I really wish that he would have let me know prior to it getting out of hand. By his negligence, he put me in a position where I was pretty much SoL. I mean, think of it from where I stood. What would you do? Would you just roll over, and take it? 'Cause I'm not. I'm done doing that.
Negligence? Hmm... "Failure to act as a reasonable person would act." How would a reasonable person have acted in the same situation? There's an entire industry dedicated to figuring that out; I'm not about to try to do it here. I can make a value judgement, which is obviously different than the one you made.
As for being out of luck, well...
You had options, you knew you had options, and you chose not to exercise them. You weren't shit out of luck. Claiming that you were erodes your already weak position.
And onto...
I sez: You are burnt out, jaded and calling sour grapes. You are trying to play the political game the same way your Knight did, except that you really and truely do want everyone to like you, which is not an option by that method. You feel betrayed, which you have been, but not by whom you think. You are an intelligent and reasonable man, who has been poisoned by the vipers whispering in his ears, telling him "they all hate you" and "they are trying to hurt you" and "that should rightfully be yours." None of that is true.
Who told you this? I've made up this decision, and formulated this position after long hours of contemplation, and re-reading all of the emails and researching events that transpired beginning around last election. Perhaps I made the poor choice in bringing this to light now. Perhaps it was the straw that broke the camels back, and I couldn't take it anymore. I don't know what caused me to feel the way I do, but I'm not going to mask it, or hide it anymore.
Who told me? No one. It's a result of first- and second-hand observation. Now, I'm the first to admit that there may be flaws in the test data. Show me the flaws, show me inconsistent examples, and I'll re-assess my position.
How do I know you're jaded and burnt? I know because I've been there, too. It shows in the argument: Everything is internally consistent, but it's a house of cards. Knock one down, and you start losing ground hand over fist.
How do I know that you are trying to play politics by "The Bel Method"? Because I was there when Bel was perfecting it. Bel plays the Third Game, and he plays it well, but the way he does it doesn't work if you care about people hating you. Your actions in the past show that you really do care what other people think about you; that is the fatal flaw in the technique, although I don't think it is a flaw in your character.
How do I know that you're feeling betrayed? Because I read the lists and the forums, and I'm not blind. And frankly, I can't say I would feel any different in the same situation.
How do I know you're a smart and reasonable man? Because I know you. I know that eventually, whatever this is will work itself out of your system; I just hope it does so sooner, rather than later.
Perhaps all of those emails I have will put your mind into my shoes a little bit.
Great, I've shown you mine, Tal's shown you hers, and (scary metaphors aside) let's see yours. Even if you don't want to post them here, I'm still interested in seeing them. I can't promise that I will agree with you after reading them, but I might be able to see where you are coming from a bit better.
However, to answer your question, yes, those people would still be doing those things. Most of them, though, wouldn't be doing it here.
Well...why not? Just because you don't get something for your contribution doesn't mean that it's any less valuable...or at least, it shouldn't...
You're right, recognition shouldn't make a difference, but it does. It's a simple fact: People like getting awards, they like getting recognition for their deeds. Is it a good thing? Hell if I know, it just is. But look at it: Lack of recognition is one of the Big Three topics to bitch about (along with sloughing and apathy). There's a reason that is so.
You're kind of missing my point, though. I'm really trying to question the 'why.' Why do these things need to be done? If someone 'has' to do something, then they're putting their time, effort, and often money into something that they do not believe in. Why? Why pain ourselves to go to such lengths? If the group dies because of apathy, then let it die. Don't continue to parade a charade in front of everyone and pretend that everything's hunky dory.
Why not let things die because of apathy? Because we are better than that. Sometimes, real life interferes. Sometimes, we just need a break. But if everyone just sat down and "let it die", then neither you nor I would have a park to play in.
I was tempted to end this on a shot, but honestly, it's not worth it. This isn't about breaking down other people; this is about open, honest debate, and I've tried to keep it objective and neutral. Allow me to apologize in advance to anyone I've offended, and feel free to PM me if I have, so I can avoid doing so next time.
*Edited because I had an extra stupid quote tag >
Post edited by: cullum, at: 2005/10/05 01:24Superstar, do you think you're what they say you are?
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Brennen MacGregor
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Posts: 142
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 02:00Uncle Willie wrote: GODSDAMIT! All of you have stired the shit to the point there is none left for me!
Obie and Kord are gay and are secretly lovers! Brenan likes to watch!
w00t! My first post in here and I'm already a gay voyeur! Or maybe that's some other Brennen, or maybe Uncle Willie just can't read.
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Cullum
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Posts: 246
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 02:27Nah... Just 'cuz the two sentences are one right after the other doesn't mean they're about the same thing (somewhere on my hard drive I have a handful of old JW posts that would demonstrate that quite well).
However, I think that I just compared Willie's writing style to JW's... Sorry dude.Superstar, do you think you're what they say you are?
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Hoshi Akuma
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Posts: 536
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 04:54:oints And laughs at Rioko:: AAHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHA you started a friggin can of worms!AHAHHAHAHAHHAHHAA When there is no light, there is dark; When there is no dark, there is light; When there is both dark and light, there is Bendu
Did they look like psychos? They were f%$#in' vampires. Psychos don't explode when sunlight hits'em, I don't care how crazy they are. - S
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Khanar
Visitor
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 07:20Wow.
I've met probably a dozen Knights in the core. I can honestly say that in the few years I've played the game, the IM Knights have impressed me any time I've had personal interactions with them. I can't say the same for other kingdoms, but I am pleased that the kingdom I swear fealty to (over such a long distance) has the quality people that it does.
After reading the above thread, I mainly feel sad. I'm sad that a young girl has been affected by others' opinions to the point that she's not sure she wants to play anymore. This type of thing can spread like a disease. Next thing you know, two of her friends don't want to come out either. Then the young men, eager to impress the females of the pack, lose interest as well. A vibrant young shire brought down by personal vitriol that really has nothing at all to do with their group.
I may be on crack, but I'm sure that causing such a circumstance is NOT an example of a knightly virtue. We have several shires that have great promise out here in the east, and even though Sir Zodiac professes to be Satan, I'm proud that we have a group of knights in our Principality that will support and nurture those growing groups.
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SerpentaraDJ
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Posts: 58
Re:Knighthood and the IM - 2005/10/05 08:06Opinions are like Assholes, everyones got one. Point is everyone is going to have a different opinion about knights. You like some you don't like others. Thats what makes this game so cool. If everyone shared the same opinion or liked all the same people it would be boring.
Home 
oints And laughs at Rioko:: AAHAHAHHAHHAHAHHAHA 
